I had no doubt of the truth of this goal from day one... ever since Lebanon 2 summers ago... there was no need for ground troops at all... the u.s. led coalition bombed Iraq for 45 days or so before sending in the goon squads... why aren't we allowed to do the same thing... nato too bombed Serbia unjustifiably for a month before sending in their gaols... this is sickening... not just a double standard in the world as some might say... but true betrayal and perfidy by fellow jews to follow the NWO orders of the slime to weaken and demoralize our only army of defense for the Jewish people anywhere on earth... this is the kiyum of Gog uMaygog scenario spoken of in Zechariah 14... "and Jerusalem will fight (with Gog) against Yerushalayim..." here it is in black and white in Gaza as in Leb. before this... we are in for another horrible historical blow to our peoplehood and against our homeland... until Hashem decides to step in, take over and end our millennia of agony... b'mehayrah v'yamaynu... amen selah... coup now!!! nik.
It strengthens him because before this he looked like a wimp. He was hated, people were furious at him for allowing the rockets to fall non -stop. He is not really running against a right-winger, but they wanted to kick him out of Labor, of politics altogether. Now Kadima, Labor, etc, is looking good in the eyes of the wishy-washy Rishon/Ashdod/Ashkelon crowd, the really stupid ones who make their decisions based on the Israeli newspapers and from TV. And he looks like the tough general, which Israelis love. Makes them feel secure.
I like the way you describe the starting line, You're right!
If you lived here, I think you'd get it, because you'd be reading the news day by day.
I think we are fighting in order to:
1. get Barak reelected to some important position, such as defense minister; and to get Kadima reelected, mostly, rather than Bibi.
2. make sure Abbas can stay in his position, and can rule Gaza instead of Hamas, and
3.for a palestinian state, as per orders of her royal highness condoleeza rice, as per wishes of the CFR and the Vatican - read the news if you don't believe me
If, at the same time, there is some calm in Sderot, and some Israelis temporarily benefit as well,.... oh, well, what can we do: we win some, we lose some.
That is the POLITICAL view.
Maybe that is why the government couldn't clearly express their goal of the war: the truth is just too shocking, cynical and despicable.
On the other hand, there is the SPIRITUAL VIEW, as per that Mekubal Leon Levi, who thinks the battle is very real and is for survival.
And , according to Elyakim Haetzni, it is better if Hamas is vanquished, but not eliminated, so Hamas and Fatah can keep at each other's throat, and a palestinian state doesn't come to be.
My only comment here is what a joke. Let's just reelect barak now and dispense with Gaza once and for all.
How many times can we make the same mistake again and again. We left lebanon, we left gush katif and so on. Each time the violence has gotten closer to home. They don't need longer range rockets, we just keep moving the starting line closer. There is no chance of true Bitachon in the Israeli meaning of the word.
I am confused. Why does this strenghten barak? The liberals who vote for him are the same who would give away all the land for peace, will still vote for him. The Chassidim don't want the land (and they say they don't use government resources). The russians will fight because they are told to... But so many are not Jewish so "cause" is not in their directives.
The charreidim who fight and the settlers who really fight won't reelect him.
So, why are we fighting? If it were TO WIN I would be impressed. Its just politics as usual.
I must be growing stupid in my old age as I understand none of this.
PS: It is true that putting the soldiers in danger, if the only goal was to help the NWO, is totally unacceptable.
But now that they are there, we really have to pray for them, that they should all come back home whole. B"H
NU's Katz: Livni Remarks Emasculate IDF, Strengthen Hamas
Tevet 14, 5769, 10 January 09 10:06by Gil Ronen
(IsraelNN.com) The National Union's leader, Yaakov "Ketzaleh" Katz, blasted Foreign Minister Tzipi Livni Saturday evening for her remarks in a Washington Post / Newsweek interview. Livni's commitment not to reconquer Gaza exudes weakness, he said. "The commitment emasculates the offensive spirit of the IDF operation and strengthens Hamas's morale," he said.
"The idea is not to reoccupy the Gaza Strip," Livni was quoted as saying in the interview. "When we left the Gaza Strip, Hamas used to write on billboards that terror won and Israel left Gaza because of terror. So today the message for the Palestinians is that we left the Gaza Strip in order to create hopes for peace. But now we are coming back because of terror."
When asked if Israel was thinking about stopping the operation in Gaza, Livni answered: "On a daily basis. We are not looking to reoccupy the Gaza Strip. But we need to see that we achieved our goals."
[FOR WHAT THOSE GOALS ARE, SEE ABOVE, AND CRY]
She then went on to explain that "the Annapolis process is based on the understanding that we are working with a pragmatic leadership in the Palestinian Authority while fighting terror. It is a zero-sum game when Hamas is getting stronger while Abu Mazen is getting weaker. The Palestinians need to understand that Israel can share and implement and translate the vision of two states for two peoples with those that accept this vision, who accept Israel's existence and renounce violence and terrorism. Hamas does not. Hamas does not represent the national aspirations of the Palestinians. It represents extreme Islamic ideas, which they share with Iran, Hizbullah and Syria."
Since Tuesday it has become clear that the Olmert-Livni-Barak government has decided to end the war with Iran's Hamas proxy army in Gaza as quickly as possible. That is, the government has decided to lose the war.
Most Israelis are unaware of this state of affairs. In an obvious attempt to bolster the popularity of Foreign Minister Tzipi Livni and Defense Minister Ehud Barak ahead of the February 10 general elections, the local media have spent the six days since the government launched Operation Cast Lead praising the government's competence and wisdom, and declaring victory over Hamas after every IAF sortie in Gaza.
What the media have declined to notice is that the outcome of the war will not be determined by the number of Hamas buildings the IAF destroys. The outcome of this war - like the outcome of all wars - will be determined by one factor only: Which side will achieve the goals it set out for itself at the outset of the conflict and which side will concede its goals?
Depressingly, the current machinations of the Olmert-Livni-Barak government demonstrate that when the fighting is over, Hamas and not Israel will be able to declare that it accomplished its goals.
Hamas reinstated its attacks against southern Israel on December 19. It did so after a six-month hiatus that it used to restock its arsenals and strengthen its military forces. As it resumed its terror offensive against Israeli cities, Hamas announced that it will continue its current round of terror war until it wins full control over Gaza's land and sea borders.
Israel, for its part, has been less clear in stating its operational goals. Prime Minister Ehud Olmert, Livni and Barak have said that the goal of Operation Cast Lead is to compel Hamas to end its attacks against Israel, but they haven't said how they intend to affect that outcome. They have rejected Hamas's demand for control over Gaza's land and sea borders and in turn demanded that Hamas end its weapons smuggling operations across the Egyptian border.
Somewhat disconnectedly, the Olmert-Livni-Barak government has demanded that in the event it reaches some sort of mediated accord with Hamas, an international monitoring force must be deployed to Gaza to enforce its terms. Since Wednesday, this appears to have become Israel's main demand in relation to any mediated cease-fire talks with Hamas.
As for cease-fire talks, as the IAF finds fewer and fewer targets to hit, those hypothetical talks have become the government's new focus. On Monday and Tuesday, Turkey, Egypt and the EU all began offering various truce arrangements between Israel and Hamas. On Tuesday, Israel opted to pursue the European track. On Thursday, Livni travelled to Paris to discuss it with French President Nicolas Sarkozy ahead of his trip to the region on Monday.
Apparently the government's decision to go with Europe is based on aesthetics. The Europeans have been more polite to Israel than Turkey or Egypt have. But the fact is that there is little substantive difference between any of the cease-fire offers now being bandied about.
Hamas, for its part, has accepted all of the proposals on the table, and this makes sense. The Europeans, the Egyptians and the Turks have all adopted Hamas's demand for control of its land and sea borders as a starting point. None has included any demands for Hamas to disarm, end its weapons trafficking or commit itself to a permanent cease-fire.
In an apparent bow to Israel, the EU's draft that Livni is now negotiating also speaks of the EU's willingness to deploy monitoring forces to Gaza's borders with Israel and Egypt, and presumably to its coast. The EU foresees the deployment of monitors following the model developed by the EU monitors who were deployed at the Rafah terminal two months after Israel withdrew from the zone in September 2005, and who fled in June 2007 after Hamas took over Gaza.
According to its draft cease-fire proposal, the EU has agreed to return European monitors to Rafah, and is "willing to examine the possibility of extending its assistance to other crossing points."
BEFORE THE Olmert-Livni-Barak government accepts the EU cease-fire, it is worth noting three strategic problems with what they are doing. Taken together and separately, all three will lead Israel to defeat in this confrontation with Hamas.
The first problem with the EU proposal is that it takes for granted that all of Hamas's demands must be met in full. That is, Israel is beginning these negotiations from a point of weakness whereby it has already effectively accepted Hamas's demands and conceded its own.
The second problem with the decision to accept EU mediation is that by doing so, the government is compelled to ignore and indeed justify the EU's underlying and deep-seated hostility toward Israel. The very fact that the EU accepted Hamas's demands from the outset demonstrates clearly that the EU cannot be an honest broker between the warring factions.
Here it is important to recall just what Hamas is. Hamas is an illegal terrorist organization and an Iranian proxy that is conducting an illegal terror war against Israel. The EU is arguably committing a war crime by accepting Hamas as a legitimate side to a dispute. In turn, by accepting the EU as a legitimate interlocutor, Israel itself gives credence to the view that Hamas is a legitimate actor.
On a practical level, by accepting the EU's authority to mediate under these conditions, Israel has effectively foregone from the outset any chance of achieving its own cease-fire demands. After all, to reach a cease-fire with Hamas that includes Israel's demands that Hamas end its weapons smuggling operations, forgo control over international borders and end its missile offensive against Israel, the EU would have to throw out the draft it just voted to accept. And it would have to reverse its political direction and abandon Hamas in favor of Israel. The chance that this will happen is quite close to zero.
The third strategic failure inherent in Israel's decision to negotiate a truce is Israel's demand for an international monitoring force to verify compliance with the cease-fire agreement. This demand is self-defeating because such a force will only harm Israel's national interests. This is the clear lesson of both the EU's past monitoring mission at the Rafah terminal and of UNIFIL forces in southern Lebanon.
In the case of the EU monitors at Rafah, as The Jerusalem Post recalled in an editorial on Wednesday, during the period when they were deployed at the terminal, the EU monitors turned a blind eye to the very terror traffic they were supposed to be preventing. At the same time, they condemned Israel for taking any action to defend itself and downplayed the threat Hamas constitutes for Israel. In short, the EU monitors sided with Hamas against Israel at every turn.
In the case of UNIFIL forces in Lebanon, the situation is little different. UNIFIL routinely condemns the IAF for carrying out reconnaissance flights over Lebanon aimed at keeping tabs on Hizbullah arms smuggling operations that UNIFIL does nothing to prevent. They also demand that Israel surrender the town of Ghajar to Lebanon despite the fact that it is part of sovereign Israel. Beyond that, UNIFIL forces have sat back and allowed Hizbullah to rearm and reassert control over some 130 villages along the Israeli border. Far from enforcing the UN-mediated cease-fire, UNIFIL acts as a shield behind which Hizbullah prepares for its next round of war against Israel.
IN LIGHT of all of this, it is apparent that today the Olmert-Livni-Barak government is conducting cease-fire negotiations from a position of great weakness. It has accepted the mediation of a hostile interlocutor. And its primary demand in those negotiations is antithetical to the national interest.
The fact of the matter is that negotiating with Hamas is a fool's game. There are only two ways for a state to impact its enemy's behavior. It can take away its desire to attack, or it can deny its enemy the ability to attack it.
In the case at hand, Livni, Barak and Olmert claim that the IAF strikes against Hamas targets in Gaza have been so successful that the Islamist group is now compelled to reassess its desire to attack Israel, and that this is why it makes sense to negotiate a cease-fire today. But the facts on the ground do not back this assertion.
By maintaining its demand for control over the borders, Hamas has made clear that it has not changed its calculations of its interests. And this makes sense. Israel's air attacks have not degraded Hamas's ability to maintain control over Gaza in any significant way. IAF attacks have only destroyed between five and 10 percent of Hamas's smuggling tunnels, and so Hamas can still restock its arsenals. The IAF has caused no significant damage to Hamas's 20,000-man army, which went to ground before the operation began. Hamas's military and political leaders are also all safely in hiding.
Moreover, Israel's willingness to begin negotiations based on a draft that favors Hamas shows Hamas that far from losing this war, it is winning. So why would it reconsider its desire to attack Israel?
In truth, given Hamas's commitment to Israel's destruction at all costs and its indifference to the lives of its Palestinian subjects, there is only one way for Israel to secure its territory from Hamas attack. It must destroy Hamas's ability to wage war. The only way Israel can achieve its aim is by conquering Gaza, overthrowing Hamas's regime and destroying its military forces. Since the Olmert-Livni-Barak government has already stated that it will not launch such an attack, it is obvious that Hamas will end this war with its ability to attack Israel more or less intact.
All of this leads us to a very nasty conclusion. The Olmert-Livni-Barak government now leading Israel in its war against Hamas is no different from the Olmert-Livni-Peretz government that led Israel in the 2006 war against Hizbullah. Our leaders have learned nothing from their prior failure. Indeed they are reenacting it in Gaza today.
The only thing the public can hope for, and indeed demand at this stage, is for Olmert, Livni and Barak to forego any ground operation in Gaza. There is no reason for our soldiers to place their lives in jeopardy in a campaign that the government that has already decided to lose.
This article can also be read at http://www.jpost.com /servlet/Satellite?cid=1230733137803&pagename=JPArticle%2FShowFull
Sunday, January 11, 2009
Tsippi Livni is confessing what we've been saying all along - including Carolyn Glick, in her recent article, and in her own language: this war, as seen by the Israeli government, is NOT being waged for the benefit of Israel, but for the NWO.
Posted by DS at 1:38 AM